Timing Belts, the sleeping time bomb

mjb · Post by **mjb** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 10:43 pm

jameslxdt wrote:you should have a bash at doing the belt yourself mjb, the turbo belt is so easy

I hate you.

Took 4 hours to get the wheelarch liner and upper cambelt cover off... at which point we said "f*ck it" and just put it all back together. It's just not something I can do.

The wheelarch liner needs new screws all round - only 3 were actually able to be removed with a torx screwdriver, the rest had rusted. The cambelt cover was a nightmare to get off with next to no access to the thing, even with all the pipes and the ECU loom horribly bent and tied back - Had to resort to a 13mm spanner clamped in a pair of mole-grips just to undo the sod!

Then it seems as if someone's fitted the wrong cambelt cover as it's quite obvious someone's hacked bits off it (and it was still a pain to re-fit!).

Got that far and decided it wasn't something I'd reasonably be able to continue myself. Heck I couldn't even get a socket on the crankshaft pulley and couldn't actually *see* 90% of the side of the engine, let alone be able to route a belt around. Saw the tensioner... no bloody way of getting a spanner down/up to it though. Couldn't see the water pump at all though.

At least one good thing came from this - I've seen the condition of the cambelt and although it's showing mild signs of wear (shiny) on the teeth, it looks in bloody good condition, so I'm not so worried about it any more. Shame the same can't be said of the alternator belt, but that's not going to be expensive if it breaks

Knowing this, I'm going to save for another month before sending it to a garage to do the work.

GAH! At least I've tried.

jameslxdt · Post by **jameslxdt** » Sun Apr 08, 2007 2:06 pm

mjb wrote:
jameslxdt wrote:you should have a bash at doing the belt yourself mjb, the turbo belt is so easy
I hate you.

thats nice

well as the top cover aint original you can bet the belt has been done at some point, you cant really tell the condition of the belt just by looking at it, as it could easily be streched out of shape, its more common for a belt to stretch or shred than snap, i dont think ive ever seen a completley snapped belt

Post by **Welly** » Mon Apr 09, 2007 11:50 am

Bloody hell m, that sounds like a nightmare.

Well done for giving up. I mean, it could have gotten much, much worse.

I reckon those jobs are best done on proper ramps so you can get the thing in the air. And if you've wasted all that time just getting liners out and covers off then you are already up against it aren't you.

Be carefull with the arch liners now, they can blow out at speed with the air pressure if you never managed to get a good fixing back in place.

My Mazda V6 was on it's original belt of 8 years (although only 45,000 miles) and to be honest it was OK really.

Maybe just see how you go?

Malachy · Post by **Malachy** » Thu Apr 19, 2007 10:29 am

i have to add a comment to this thread really.

timing belts have a time duration too, NOT just milage, they are made of rubber and perish with time.

So your 7 yr old 30,000 mile car could go at anytime especially if the time duration is 3-4years.

DO not solely go on milage or your car will be the above quoted "timebomb".

cambelts are perfectly reliable if the figures are stuck to its when people go "oo well i havent done this milage yet" and the belt is 10 years old they get all upset when it snaps.

as a general rule of thumb 3years and 40k is good for all cars

as for changing the belt on pug engines its a piece of piss tbh, hardest part is getting the plastic covers off and undoing the bottom pulley. In fact i would happily say i can do one with waterpump and tensioners easily within 2 hours on my drive.

mjb · Post by **mjb** » Thu Apr 19, 2007 10:59 am

Malachy wrote:as for changing the belt on pug engines its a piece of piss tbh, hardest part is getting the plastic covers off and undoing the bottom pulley. In fact i would happily say i can do one with waterpump and tensioners easily within 2 hours on my drive.

Er, does that include the XU10J2TE in a 406? I found I had severe problems just getting my hand anywhere near the belt area, which is why I gave up - the complete lack of access was a showstopper for me. How do you set and check the tension of a belt you can barely even reach with a screwdriver?

Malachy · Post by **Malachy** » Thu Apr 19, 2007 11:05 am

your not trying hard enough

i have that engine in my 306 and theres far less room

i often find taking the top engine mount off helps a lot gives you a fait bit of movement and it only 5 nuts + 2 allen key bolts

also haveing a decent tool kit helps a lot trying to do it with teccy value molegrips wont work.
checking the tensiuon is easy enough due to the engine being in at 30degree angle you can check from underneeth or if needed remove the driver side wheel and youll have tonnes of room

Malachy · Post by **Malachy** » Thu Apr 19, 2007 11:06 am

edit: gah crappy work internet and double posts!

mjb · Post by **mjb** » Thu Apr 19, 2007 7:08 pm

The wheel WAS off! I still couldn't see sh*t through there :/ As for the mole grips... They were just used to hold the spanner. Why the stupid bolt thing holding the top cover on has to stick out an inch so you can't just fit a socket over the top, I'll never know

Why couldn't they just use a normal bolt instead of one that's threaded 3/4" on the outside?

TooT · Post by **TooT** » Thu Apr 19, 2007 7:39 pm

Malachy wrote:as for changing the belt on pug engines its a piece of piss tbh, hardest part is getting the plastic covers off and undoing the bottom pulley. In fact i would happily say i can do one with waterpump and tensioners easily within 2 hours on my drive.

Just wondering mate, does that include th V6, ive heard its a barsteward.

Malachy · Post by **Malachy** » Thu Apr 19, 2007 7:46 pm

TooT wrote:
Malachy wrote:as for changing the belt on pug engines its a piece of piss tbh, hardest part is getting the plastic covers off and undoing the bottom pulley. In fact i would happily say i can do one with waterpump and tensioners easily within 2 hours on my drive.
Just wondering mate, does that include th V6, ive heard its a barsteward.

never really had much to do with the v6

engine snever really apealed to me as i have a 306 and to make the power i want a v6 isnt really an option.

mjb · Post by **mjb** » Sun Jun 03, 2007 9:48 pm

OK I had another crack at it today.

Engine mount off and everything became sooo easy.... until I tried to take the crankshaft pulley off. Is there some trick here? I was using a 22mm socket at the end of my 18" bar and I was dragging myself along the road instead of turning the bolt! It's been soaked in WD40 and everything. It just won't budge. Whacking it with an impact driver did nothing, same as just clouting the bar! The damn thing would not move!!!

What's the trick to this?

Also why don't my crankshaft and camshaft timing holes line up? They're about 30 degrees apart, so how are you supposed to lock both?

niz406 · Post by **niz406** » Mon Jun 04, 2007 1:02 am

mjb wrote:OK I had another crack at it today.

Engine mount off and everything became sooo easy.... until I tried to take the crankshaft pulley off. Is there some trick here? I was using a 22mm socket at the end of my 18" bar and I was dragging myself along the road instead of turning the bolt! It's been soaked in WD40 and everything. It just won't budge. Whacking it with an impact driver did nothing, same as just clouting the bar! The damn thing would not move!!!

What's the trick to this?

Also why don't my crankshaft and camshaft timing holes line up? They're about 30 degrees apart, so how are you supposed to lock both?

What you locked the flywheel with?

It shouldn't take that much to get it off... and why oh why, did you remove the engine mount lol Its not needed lol !

mjb · Post by **mjb** » Mon Jun 04, 2007 5:20 am

niz406 wrote:What you locked the flywheel with?

The gearbox and brakes

It shouldn't take that much to get it off... and why oh why, did you remove the engine mount lol Its not needed lol !

I can't fit my hands anywhere near the belt area with it on. It's the difference between the cover bolts being a piece of piss and them being a nightmare requiring the mole-grips to extend the spanner's reach, only being able to turn the bolt 1/6th of a turn each time, taking over 2 hours to get off, etc

Malachy · Post by **Malachy** » Mon Jun 04, 2007 12:32 pm

wedge a breaker bar against the tarmac (obviously with a socket on the bolt and the breaker bar the correct way to undo when the engine turns over)

unclip the 4 pin electrical plug that goes onto the coil pack (4 pin bosch clip) this will stop the engine firing

turn the engine over on the starter motor for a second

always gets stubborn crank pulley bolts undone

removing the top engine moun makes a lot of the jobs far easier and much quicker its only 7 bolts (3 nuts and 4 bolts) so literally takes 5 mins

Post by **Welly** » Mon Jun 04, 2007 12:53 pm

Are you undoing it the right way?