JUMPING OUT OF FIFTH

[BOF]

Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. Forum newbie here. My son's 1998 406 2.0 16-valve saloon has been jumping out of fifth on the overrun, and now will not stay in fifth gear even if held in. He has the mechanical sympathy - and ability - of an orangutan, so it falls to me to fix the thing (I DO know one end of a spanner from the other).

The problem dramatically worsened over a 50-mile journey, which leads me to think that it might well be the securing nut on the 1st/5th rail, which I gather is prone to come loose, and can be tightened after removing the gearbox end cover. I have Mr. Haynes' manual, but they're a bit kak these days compared to when I were a lad, and it makes no mention of even minor gearbox dismantling, let alone providing diagrams. I'm hoping someone on here can supply the info I need.

Do I need to drain any oil out before removing the gearbox end plate, and once the end plate is off, is it immediately apparent what needs tightening (assuming that IS the problem, of course). I don't suppose anyone has any pics of the operation?

And perhaps more importantly, are there published torque settings for the nut itself, and for the end cover securing bolts?

Please help...

BOF (Forty-one years of bodging...)

[steve_earwig]

Hi there. I can't think that anyone's been here (I could be wrong of course), the usual procedure (after checking linkages etc.) is to get another box from the breakers I don't recall jumping out of 5th either, they usually seem to strip teeth...

I can't see why you can't take the end cover off, it doesn't look like anything will fall inside. I'd imagine you need to drain the oil, inside it looks like you'll be presented with the ends of the 1st and 2nd motion shafts.

Have some pictures:
http://www.peugeotpartscatalogue.co.uk/D8F/2/22D05A.HTM
http://www.peugeotpartscatalogue.co.uk/D8F/2/22D50A.HTM
http://www.peugeotpartscatalogue.co.uk/D8F/2/23B01A.HTM
http://www.peugeotpartscatalogue.co.uk/D8F/2/23A01A.HTM

Haynes do seem a bit lacking now compared to days of old, I think there's just too many variables. The "typical" wiring diagrams aren't much cop either

Luck!!

[BOF]

Took the end cover off, no problem, and with that side of the car well up in the air only lost about a tablespoonful of oil. It's a BE3 'box (according to the manual). There are two shafts revealed, but the nuts on the ends of both still had their retainers in place with the staking still intact, so I left well alone and just boxed it up again.

Next step is the gearbox mounting at that end, on top of the 'box. It looks rather tired, and I'm changing it tomorrow morning. Keep fingers crossed....


BOF

[C15GrandVolume]

Bumping an old topic ;)

My '99 HDI (RHZ) has developed a similar problem. As long as i press the accellerator pedal it stays in fifth gear, but when I release the pedal it jumps out of gear to neutral.

Has any of you had this problem before? What's causing this?

[Welly]

I have never heard of anyone on this forum with problems with the internals of the gearbox's themselves. What it could be is the engine mounts allowing too much movement of the engine and it pulls on the gear linkage?

[annie]

as above...engine mounts.. mine has just started to jump out of gear very rarely. only seems to happen on cars with the lower rear engine mount in a collapsed state alowing ALOT of movement. must get mine done but its a pig of a job

[jasper5]

as above...engine mounts.. mine has just started to jump out of gear very rarely. only seems to happen on cars with the lower rear engine mount in a collapsed state alowing ALOT of movement. must get mine done but its a pig of a job

It isn't that big a job...drain gearbox oil, remove driveshaft, remove mounting bolts and plate from the back of the engine, take the mounting block to a garage and get a new mount pressed in or cut out the old one with a hacksaw blade, clean up the hole where the mount fits into, freeze the new mount then knock it partly in and press the rest of the way in a vice.Refit mount block and driveshaft then fill gearbox with 2 litres of oil.

[annie]

as above... huge pain in the bum. anyone know what hours it should book. i looked at the job last week and to be honest im thinking of just selling the car at a loss. cant find a local mechanic that doesnt lie or try and rip me off and looks to hard for me on my own....

[Welly]

Some have had reasonable success in ramming the old thing full of rubber hose off-cuts and then going nuts with the duck tape and silicone sealant, not pretty but might buy you some time.....

[annie]

ive been putting off this job for 3months now... running out of excuses..

[jasper5]

ive been putting off this job for 3months now... running out of excuses..

From what I've read you have done much more difficult jobs.

It really isn't that bad.once you have the driveshaft out there's nothing to it.
Look at it as separate jobs...
Driveshaft hub nut slackened
Car up on axle stands
Bottom ball joint split
Pull driveshaft out of hub
Gearbox oil drained
Two bolts on the inner driveshaft removed
Pull driveshaft out of gearbox
Take out bolt from lower mount
Take out bolts from mounting plate on back of engine
Take the mounting plate and new mount to garage for them to press a new mount in.
Fit the whole lot back in reverse order
Take out air filter box and fill gearbox with 2 litres of 75w80 oil through the gearbox breather hole on top of the gearbox.

As I said...look at it as a list of separate jobs.

You CAN do it

[annie]

thats great. it doesnt look so daunting when written like that. so i need a balljoint splitter.. eurocp will do that i supppose. do any bolts, bushes need replacing when putting back together.

i have an bloody awful 6month old I30 auto diesel that tows the boat but i hate it and want to sell it but cant until the engine mount is fixed and rear brakes replaced. i seem to have made this jobber harder than it needs to be.

do you know what time it should book incase i find a mechanic who doesnt suck air through his teeth when i ask about fixing a 15yr old car.

[annie]

hub nut will need a big socket and a huge breaker bar... anyone know if left or right hand thread...

[jasper5]

thats great. it doesnt look so daunting when written like that. so i need a balljoint splitter.. eurocp will do that i supppose. do any bolts, bushes need replacing when putting back together.

i have an bloody awful 6month old I30 auto diesel that tows the boat but i hate it and want to sell it but cant until the engine mount is fixed and rear brakes replaced. i seem to have made this jobber harder than it needs to be.

do you know what time it should book incase i find a mechanic who doesnt suck air through his teeth when i ask about fixing a 15yr old car.

Ideally you could replace the driveshaft oil seal.
The hub nut is 35mm and is normal right hand thread.
You don't really need a ball joint splitter see my post here....viewtopic.php?f=10&t=20950

If you take it to a garage expect to be charged 2 hours labour, but an experienced mechanic will do it in an hour or less.

[annie]

perfect thanks. i just wish we had a honest reliable mobile mechanic around here. i dont mind paying 75-100 labour but all tradesmen i meet seem to want to earn a months wages from you instead of doing an honest job.