V6 Starter Motor Repair?

[JohnL]

Hi All. My French Wench with the 3L V6 autobox, probably one of the last made as was new in late 2003, failed to start (solenoid sometimes clicked, sometimes not) and after days of battery charging and testing, the Wench was towed off.
The starter motor was pronounced faulty and sent for repair at an Auto Electrician. It is apparently a sealed unit and is "solid state" (I presume in respect of switching current to the motor by solid state, rather than contacting terminals). It was "reconditioned as best as possible - sealed unit" and is working again, but is not to be trusted as (I was told) it could die again in a month or a year or whenever. A new one is obviously quite pricey.

Any advice or experience? Can it be opened up and reconditioned?
Regards to all.
John L

[jasper5]

Hi All. My French Wench with the 3L V6 autobox, probably one of the last made as was new in late 2003, failed to start (solenoid sometimes clicked, sometimes not) and after days of battery charging and testing, the Wench was towed off.
The starter motor was pronounced faulty and sent for repair at an Auto Electrician. It is apparently a sealed unit and is "solid state" (I presume in respect of switching current to the motor by solid state, rather than contacting terminals). It was "reconditioned as best as possible - sealed unit" and is working again, but is not to be trusted as (I was told) it could die again in a month or a year or whenever. A new one is obviously quite pricey.

Any advice or experience? Can it be opened up and reconditioned?
Regards to all.
John L

Strangely enough, I rang my mate about another starter problem (he has a starter/alternator reconditioning business), I asked about this and he told me that they are able to be reconditioned, he also told me that it's the same starter as the Citroen C5.

They are not expensive trade wise, not sure about retail.

[mjb]

By 'solid state' I'm guessing they mean that the starter engages/disengages by means of a solenoid instead of something inertia-driven

The 194bhp V6's starter motor is one big unit comprising of the motor and solenoid. Your 210bhp's one is the same - I just looked it up. I didn't have mine out though, only unbolted it to move it aside got gearbox removal.

It may be possible that it's 2 discrete units inside a large bracket though, so I'd advise taking it off and having a look the other side of it if you don't think a new one (try eurocarparts and gsf, not a dealer) is worth the expense. To take it off you need to remove the engine undertray (have some zip ties to hand to put it back - the fasteners are usually rusted past the point of usefulness), unplug any connectors (oil level/temperature) behind it, remove the heat shield (2x 10mm bolts) and undo the 3x 13mm bolts holding it on. One of these will be hidden behind the exhaust pipe so don't try this with a warm engine. You may need to rotate the exhaust clamp out of the way too. Then lever the starter out of the flywheel and remove it the best you can, remembering to take care of the large power wires.

I've got memories of people saying you need to remove the manifold covers, but that didn't look necessary on mine. You may need to unbolt the power steering pipe that runs around the engine, I can't remember where that normally sits as I've had to move a lot of stuff around the last week

If you're taking it out, wear eye protection - you're likely to have a lot of crud fall on your face. Have a guess how I know this?


...and that concludes everything I know about the V6 starter

[mjb]

he also told me that it's the same starter as the Citroen C5.

Virtually the same starter on the 194bhp engine (minor part number difference, but the same diagram on servicebox, probably just a different revision of the same unit) so the V6 Citroen XM+Xantia's will probably be fine too if this ends up a hunt-round-scrapyards job

[steve_earwig]

Solid state? Hogswill, there's no power transistor that's going to handle that sort of current unless it's prohibitively expensive and what would be the point anyway? All starter motors have solenoids nowdays, they stopped using inertia engaged ones about 20 years ago. The only thing that's changed since is they started using permanent magnets for the field (cheaper, lighter) along with an epicyclic reduction gear 'cos they spin faster & have less torque.

I guess "solid state" could be bullshit for "you can't get parts for them".

ES9J4S? That'll be 5802W6, common to anything using the same block I guess:

1 document(s) found for 407 (ES9A)
1 document(s) found for 807
1 document(s) found for 607
1 document(s) found for 607 new (ES9A)

1 document(s) found for C8
1 document(s) found for C5 II (ES9A)
1 document(s) found for C5
1 document(s) found for C6 (ES9A)
1 document(s) found for C5 (X7) (ES9A)

I think I'd be looking for reconditioned.

Or there's evilbay

[JohnL]

Thanks all for your responses. The "repaired" starter is in service and the French Wench starts on command. I have tracked down Bosch starter and alternator data book on the internet, via AussieFrogs, and this lists the Bosch starter BX 110 017 as applying to V6 Citroen and Peugeot. It is beefy enough - a 1.7 kW unit. There are even photo's of it and individual part numbers (such as bushes, solenoid, etc.), so readily serviceable. I just have to ascertain whether my unit is a Bosch - and identical - or a Valeo, possibly different.
As I am in South Africa, options are more limited.
As the servicing that was done was probably quite cursory, and there are no genuine Pug starters available in this country - two weeks from France - I feel a little vulnerable without a back-up.

Regards.
John