Oil temp cluster installation in "pre-mux" D9

[min]

Hello everyone,

I drive a January 2001 406 2.2HDI (pre-mux generation) and I am interested in fitting a cluster which includes the oil temperature gauge . From the research I made so far I found out the following (please correct me where I am wrong):

a) pre-mux D9 ('99 - mid '01) has a cluster with 2 rear sockets (and use 501 bulbs instead of LEDs) and newer "fully-mux" D9s (mid '01-'04) have clusters with only one rear socket (and use only LEDs). So, besides the issues which might be faced due to differen electricals, the newer cluster cannot be phisically installed on my car due to the socket difference. I need this confirmation from you guys since I have a sort of dispute with my scrapyard parts provider - he insists that all the D9s (more than 20) he dismounted till now (both premux and mux type) had 2 sockets clusters?!?!

b) in the electrical schemas of the D9 it says that there is a single probe in the oil pan (connected to the ground plus a 3 wire connector) with double role, containing 2 variable resistors (one for oil temp and one for oil level): one resistor is connected to the ground and directly to the cluster; the second one has both ports connected to the cluster. This means that the ECU is bypassed?! This also means that my car is prepared for installing a cluster with oil temp gauge? I found in another thread that the oil temp gauge needs to be activated (with Peugeot Planet) in the cluster, in the BSI and in the ECU; is this still valid if the oil temp/level probe is connected directly to the cluster?!

c) I found at the scrapyard a cluster with 2 connectors (like mine) which includes the oil temp gauge but it is from a gasoline engine; can it be adapted/programmed (with Peugeot Planet) to work on my Diesel car? Or can I install the 3 small clocks (tank, water temp, oil temp) in my cluster (switching the front frame but keeping the rear electronics board) for keeping also the mileage from my cluster?

Any other recommendation or info related to installing the oil temp gauge on my pre-mux D9 would be welcome.

Thanks.

[FarmerPug]

The oil temperature sensor, its quite likely that one is already fitted the HDI engine, if you can get hold of a pp2000 see if it can provide readings on the oil temperature at the moment, if so its likely that all you need to do is plug in the 5 gauge cluster from another diesel 406 and activate the oil temperature on pp2000.
I don't know if you can adapt a petrol cluster to work in a diesel, its most likely going to be quite a bit of hassle trying to get it reprogrammed, so sourcing one already from a diesel might be the better option.

[steve_earwig]

As I have Sedre open, my full-mux HDi's instrument cluster has one 18-way connector. Same for a random full-mux RHD petrol RPO 9001 (first day of full-mux) so your friendly local scrappy is talking out of his bottom.

No idea on the panel from a petrol, although I'd suspect the only issue would be the rev counter but I don't know if it would be completely incomparable or you'd just rev out a long way from the red line. You might be able to combine the two, however I can't think of any other way apart from opening them up and comparing - there's no point in me looking on Service Box as details are scant and there's hundreds of the buggers.

Oil temp? I don't think the ecu is bypassed as the ecu in the dash controls the gauges, even the oil pressure switch (I didn't realise they still had one ) which goes straight to the warning light has a T for the ecu, presumably so it can ebe accessed by the diagnostic connector.

As Doggy said, it might be best to have it up on PP to check it'll work. Or at least get under it and make sure Pug bothered to add the wire for it...

[min]

Thanks everyone for the replies.

Conclusions so far:

a) premux clusters have 2 sockets, mux have one socket; most probably the scrappyard guy either confuses or is just trying to convince me to get him rid of the clusters he still has for sale...

b) my premux car has the full 3 wired probe (plus ground connection) - just checked it visually some minutes ago, so it should be prepared for the oil temp gauge installation. Still I remember I played with PP2000 in all the menus and not even in parameters measurement I haven't identified anything related to oil temp measurement or activation. Perhaps it's related to the premux electricals since I noticed that several functionalities from PP2000 are missing from the premux cars (like cluster test when all the warning lights are powered on for testing purposes). Anyway, I'll try tomorrow again with PP2000 to see what I find...

c) the mixture between a five dials cluster (with oil temp) and one with four dials (like mine) is out of discussion: meanwhile I found out that the dials are somehow soldered in the electronic board, so my plan to install the oil temp gauge on my electronic board is not doable...

So what I can do is to keep searching for a Diesel cluster with oil temp gauge and with 2 connectors - this should work on my car (but with losing the mileage record from my cluster)...

[steve_earwig]

Happy hunting It'd make things so much easier if there's the option for the oil temperature gauge in the dash but I suspect it won't be there because the gauge isn't there either

[GingerMagic]

Sorry to hijack the thread ( again ) but I would like to fit the 5 dial cluster on my 2002 Hdi, but there are different connections on the back. I tried using Service Box but it doesn't show the connection I need.

Would SEDRE have this information..??

[FarmerPug]

Gingermagic, your 2002 is a full multiplex so any late model HDi in one of the higher trim levels should be a good source for the replacement cluster the HDi coupes are probably the best place to find them.

Min, here is a 5 gague cluster from a 2000 406 so pre multiplex (although its worth emailing to check that it has the two plugs):
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/MK1-2000-2-0- ... 4d1cc430c9

The HDi engine should have the sensors all there, and i would expect peugeot to have already wired it in like they did for the trip computer (but unfortunately not the cruise control), on the multiplexed cluster the dials are not soldered on but held in place with plastic rivets, the rivets get pushed out and the stepper motors for each needle lifts off, they make their contact in the same way the parts inside a mobile phone do i.e. small springy contacts that touch a conductive part of the circuit board. I know that this is the case on the multiplexed instrument cluster, i have a few pre multiplex clusters knocking about somewhere but they are all the 4 dials, I'm not sure if they are soldered into place or not, but the 106s instrument cluster is also the same as the 406 one with each stepper motor being a removable part.

[hasler88]

My 2000 hdi 90 doesn't have the wires for the oil temp on the 2 plugs for the dials haven't checked the sensor yet, also I don't remember seeing anything for the temp gauge in the ecu settings. I'm planning on wiring it up my self if this can be done.

[min]

Min, here is a 5 gague cluster from a 2000 406 so pre multiplex (although its worth emailing to check that it has the two plugs):
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/MK1-2000-2-0- ... 4d1cc430c9

The HDi engine should have the sensors all there, and i would expect peugeot to have already wired it in like they did for the trip computer (but unfortunately not the cruise control), on the multiplexed cluster the dials are not soldered on but held in place with plastic rivets, the rivets get pushed out and the stepper motors for each needle lifts off, they make their contact in the same way the parts inside a mobile phone do i.e. small springy contacts that touch a conductive part of the circuit board. I know that this is the case on the multiplexed instrument cluster, i have a few pre multiplex clusters knocking about somewhere but they are all the 4 dials, I'm not sure if they are soldered into place or not, but the 106s instrument cluster is also the same as the 406 one with each stepper motor being a removable part.

I'll contact the seller for a double check but still the first option would be the installation of the oil temp gauge in my cluster (the one for selling is in miles, I need it in km etc). By the way, very good price (usually in Romania a cluster is around 30pounds plus shipping).

My engine defintely has the full sensors in place (I checked and it has all the three wires in the probe as the oil temp gauge cars should); the question is if it is wired completely to the ECU and dash or it's just the probe installed. I didn't have time to check additionally in PPlanet2000 yet, I'll make a search later but, as hasler88 says, I don't remember of seeing anything related to the oil temp gauge in the PPlanet menus...
Update: I checked additionally in PPlanet and I have only references about oil level sensor, nothing about oil temp; so apparently there is no menu in PPlanet where I can activate the oil temp gauge but, as mentioned above, perhaps a direct wiring from the sensor to the gauge could work?!

Regarding the dials soldered on the printed circuit board, I used this movie https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aY20Fn0kQE4 as guideline (minute 1:03 and a little at 1:22) . If the step motors are easly removable, it would be great if the printed electronic circuit board from my cluster has already the place for installing the temp oil gauge. This means I could keep my cluster, install on the rear electric printed circuit the oil temp gauge stepper motor, I'll install the intermediate white plastic board from the new cluster. In order to keep the km/h speedo, I should keep the black paper km printed (as showed in the movie) along with the water temp black paper; somehow I'll need to separate the black printed paper for the tank level step motor from the "donor" cluster and install it in mine; the rpm&oil temp gauge black printed paper should be used also from the "donor" cluster. Finally, the front black/transparent plastic case will be installed from the "donor" cluster (since mine has in the upper center the Peugeot lion sign instead of the round hole for Diesel tank level).

[FarmerPug]

The thing about that video is that i was working on a multiplexed instrument cluster, i havent really done a full dissection of a pre multiplex cluster but ill take a look in my garage tomorrow just to see what the inside of them is like, the dial faces is a bit of an issue as you say you will most likely need to cut at them and stick them together to make what you need. Remember that the 5 gauge cluster with the oil temp gauge has the oil temp in one of the corners, the fuel gauge goes up to where the peugeot lion sits.

[min]

The thing about that video is that i was working on a multiplexed instrument cluster, i havent really done a full dissection of a pre multiplex cluster but ill take a look in my garage tomorrow just to see what the inside of them is like, the dial faces is a bit of an issue as you say you will most likely need to cut at them and stick them together to make what you need. Remember that the 5 gauge cluster with the oil temp gauge has the oil temp in one of the corners, the fuel gauge goes up to where the peugeot lion sits.

Ha, ha small world, so it's you the one I spoke with on youtube and you are the author of all those useful 406 videos on youtube

Yes, it seems not only I'll have to cut the printed black paper in order to "move" the tank gauge to the middle but, if want to keep my electronics board, I'll need to transfer the connections for the tank gauge from left corner of the cluster to the middle (perhaps with ordinary wires). And, of course, I'll have to identify the oil temp wires from the probe in the electronic board or at least in one of the two back connectors and take the wires to the far left of the cluster. As hassler88 said, in worst case I could try a direct wire connection from the probe to the oil temp gauge. Still a more detailed electric schema of the dash (more detailed than Haynes) would be welcome...

As you said, if you could have a look tomorrow within a premux cluster it would be great for me and others who want to improve their dash In my case the obsession for oil temp gauge is related to my driving high speed on highway; although always the water temp is ok, it is healthy to monitor also the oil temp during high load on engine. Actually among the cars I owned, only on an old gasoline Passat I installed also the dash with oil temp from a Golf GTI cluster; the cluster of the 406 with all the electronics I think is more complex than the whole electronics my old Passat had at that time )))

[hasler88]

I have all the diagrams from sedre for the oil temp will upload it tomorrow when I'm in front of the pc

[FarmerPug]

I stripped a pre multiplex cluster down today, here is the photo album of the disassembly if it helps:
http://s908.photobucket.com/user/406exe ... tiveHDI011

even though this came out of a HDi 90 with a manual gearbox the cluster has the holes for the automatic gearbox:


There are also holes left for the fuel gauge to be moved to the top middle slot:


on the back of the circuit board there is places for the solder to go:


The needle motors are soldered in on these earlier clusters:

shouldn't be too hard to unsolder or resolver these into place

I don't know what way the software on these clusters works if you can just plonk a new motor and needle in and hope it works, i still think getting a 5 gauge cluster would be easiest then just try and convert it to KMH, although our MPH speedometers still have KMH markings on them, but they are smaller.

[hasler88]

I think there might be some software on the dials wasn't many options on my set of 4 dials and no oil temp to enable only had that on the 5 dial

[min]

Thanks a lot for the detailed pictures and all other details. It doesn't seem too difficult to solder in place the dials. Still there are some question marks referring to poles (how the 4 pins are connected in the electrical circuits)...

@hassler88: if you could post or send the electrical schema of the cluster from Sedre it would be very helpful.

Thanks.