Newbie DESPERATE HELP DORSET Anti Pollution limp mode

[Tasharaps]

Hi Guys,
Been ripped off i think, bought my first pug (406 2.2 diesel estate) a few days ago... no remote for sat nav...oh isnt it their he said!! no worries i was more concerned with engine etc.. wanted decent family car that would occaisonally tow caravan. Drove fine, gearbox fine etc etc... Now 3 days on "Engine antiPollution system diffective" car in limp mode. I am absolutely gutted. As i think it could be one of 1000 things. Seems to be starting to have probs starting too. I am a gardener have zero mechanical knowledge and cant afford to take it to Peugeot. Is their anybody out their near Sherborne in Dorset who may be able to help me? Rang bloke i bought it from who waffled some rubbish and wont give me a refund. I am at my wits end as i thought i was buying a decent car and spent over my budget on it. its 2001 model with 140,000 miles on the clock. Any advice would be greatfully recieved n rapkins at aol dot com Pleaseeeeeee....

[lozz]

Hi mate,
sorry to hear about the car being a pup,

iwouid move or put spaces in the email address youve added if iwas you,
its an open forum so you couid end up Bombarded with millions of emails, spam and other junk

[waue1978]

First off, don't panic. Sounds like you've been caught the same way I was a few years ago. I bought a Citroen C5 with the 2.2 engine a few years ago & had the warning lights come on during the drive home, but when I bought mine the particle filter technology (which is the current cause of your grief) was too new & it was a dealer only job.

Nowadays people have managed to get rid of them. If you have zero mechanical knowledge, it may cost you a few quid to get the job done, but it will be worth it in the end as the engines & cars are sound - it's just the particle filters that let them down.

Our resident deFAPping (FAP is the Peugeot/Citroen term for it) expert is usually happy to help where he can with the software side of things (uploading the appropriate file to your ECU), but he does live about 100 miles or so North of you.

There is a guy on the 406 Coupe forum (& sometimes pops on here for a guest appearance) who has almost made it his life's work to get rid of as many as possible. His name is Finchy & he is based in Tewkesbury & has helped a few people through the physical & software side of deFAPping. However, he is in the midst of a house move at the mo, so may not be able to for a wee while.

Or (if you can manage to scrape together another few quid) there are several specialist companies that have set up all over the country that can offer the same service. Honestly don't know how much they charge, but there is one that isn't too far away from you. They're called Reidyremaps & I believe they're based in Taunton.

Out of curiosity, how did you buy the car? Was it private or trade? Ebay or Autotrader?

[Doggy]

Hi & welcome to the forum.

As waue says, with a 2.2 HDi showing these problems it's natural to assume the diesel particle filter, (or FAP), is to blame, but there are other possibilities.

Are there any other messages on the MFD, apart from 'ANTIPOLLUTION FAULT' ?

There is a warning light for the particle filter, is it on?

Struggling to start, (turning over longer than usual), together with a puff of black smoke / soot when it starts, can be a sign of a blocked particle filter. Does yours do that?

[rwb]

1. Welcome.
2. Off to a bad start, but you've bought a brilliant motor so hang in there and I'm sure it's you that'll be having the last laugh.

The "engine anti-polution system defective" is a generic error message that could literally mean anything. Therefore you need to get the fault code read. Any decent garage should be able to do this, and shouldn't charge much (if anything). Even if they can only get the code itself, you can look it up on the list of doom.

(My most common fault is throttle position sensor. They're about £20 off eBay and 5 minutes to fit. Of course, the first step is to get the code read so that you know what the problem is.)

If it is the particle filter then, as doggy says, there should be an additional orange light on that looks a bit like, well, a bit like a particle filter. Doggy is the genius in the particle filter department. The principle is to remove the filter and tweak the computer to forget about it.

[Tasharaps]

Thanks all.
After meltdown i took car out for a spin just to see how it drove. conked out in town...starter motor faulty...rac wacked with hammer and got me home. so now its that too. bloke who sold car (Autotrader, Taunton) called peugeot.co says if i take motor back he can sort anti pollution thingy out. But i think what he is going to actually do is clear the dam codes so i will have same prob later. However i will give him the chance...if no luck i will just have to keep going on with sorting it out. I have no choice anyway. I think it will be good car when/if it gets sorted out. Anyone got starter motor ha ha!!

[lozz]

If youve only just bought it,
take it back , unless youve sighned some sort of disclaimer you have the Rights to Have him/her rectify the faults or have a full Refund,
if he/she told you about the Faults and put all the info of the Faults on the Bill of sale then its sold as Described, (point of no return)

Have alook at the Reciept /bill of sale and see if theres anything worded, like Buyer beware sold as seen no Warranty implied etc etc,
if not report seller if problems not Rectified, iwouid anyway,

Iwouid also print off the Autotrader add,

[Tasharaps]

I'm pretty sure he wont take it back. He is already getting funny with me on the phone. If i return to him he is only going to clear the codes and then i will have same prob in a few days time. Not sure its worth my fuel money to go back. Cant print out ad as i called regarding another car which was gone and this was one he had (coming in) I think i have just been sold a faulty car with cleared codes so now i need to find someone to help me repair it. Car still drives but is in limp mode. I also have dodgy starter motor. Iim going to have to take to local garage unless anyone else can help as i think all people on here who can help live too far away. I cant afford peugeot labour prices. Nothing on my reciept to say i can return car, have had it less than a week. Only bonus is the heated seats work !! Just noticed reciept actually is home printed junk.....stiched up like a kipper. Shame as rest of car is great...its like a limo inside. Engine no smoke, gearbox fine etc etc...just the anti pollution thing. Even the rac man laughed at me last night saying( french and electrics are useless) So im just going to limp around Sherborne until i find a solution. Thats if i can find a starter. !! Will keep you all updated.....stop laughing!!

[Welly]

The 406 is not "useless/french electrics" it is the best model they ever made the recovery man should not turn up to help and then start dissing the car

You will have one or two simple issues to do with the particle filter and then you'll be off like a rocket in no time.

A 2001 car is now 11 years old, there's bound to be a couple of things to sort out. I'd hate to see the state of one of these small-capacity common rail engines after 11 years

I can only advise you to answer the questions that the members above have asked you. There's a wealth of experience here and these guys are offering their help freely.

[waue1978]

I'm pretty sure he wont take it back. He is already getting funny with me on the phone. If i return to him he is only going to clear the codes and then i will have same prob in a few days time. Not sure its worth my fuel money to go back. Cant print out ad as i called regarding another car which was gone and this was one he had (coming in) I think i have just been sold a faulty car with cleared codes so now i need to find someone to help me repair it. Car still drives but is in limp mode. I also have dodgy starter motor. Iim going to have to take to local garage unless anyone else can help as i think all people on here who can help live too far away. I cant afford peugeot labour prices. Nothing on my reciept to say i can return car, have had it less than a week. Only bonus is the heated seats work !! Just noticed reciept actually is home printed junk.....stiched up like a kipper. Shame as rest of car is great...its like a limo inside. Engine no smoke, gearbox fine etc etc...just the anti pollution thing. Even the rac man laughed at me last night saying( french and electrics are useless) So im just going to limp around Sherborne until i find a solution. Thats if i can find a starter. !! Will keep you all updated.....stop laughing!!

That sounds very much to me like it came from a trader. Home or forecourt/yard? Much as Lozz says about a receipt stating no warranty etc, I have heard that you still have a bit of comeback regarding "fit for purpose", but the purchase price can also have some bearing on whether you get any help or not; i.e. if you buy a car with a retail value of £3k for £1200, you're on your own. With that in mind, how much did this car cost you?

I'm pretty sure he wont take it back. He is already getting funny with me on the phone.

That's a favourite trader's trick - they hope that if they can intimidate you by getting narky when you phone, you might be too nervous to chase anything up. Don't put up with it, a genuine decent seller would be willing to help as he would want you to be happy with what you bought. If all he does is clear the codes & they come back a few days later, keep haunting him until he fixes it properly. Always remember - he has made money on this car. That is guaranteed. If it was a px, he would have added a minimum of £200 to what he offered for it & even on the very rare occasion that a px gets sold at cost, it has only happened because there was a very healthy profit made on what it was part exchanged against. If he can't get it fixed & still keep a profit, you may find that he has no choice, but to take it back as financially he would end up better off sticking it through an auction.

Personally, I would be very interested to know who this seller is. Obviously it wouldn't be advisable to "name & shame" on a public forum due to legal complications, but if you get a chance, could you PM me his name or number, or send me a link to another car that he is selling, so that I can guage what kind of a dealer he is & more importantly give him a massive wide berth the next time I'm in the market?

Lozz - now do you see why I have such a low opinion of traders? In 17 years of driving & well over 30 cars in that time I have only ever met 2 or 3 that I would happily buy a car from - & one of them isn't even in the trade anymore as he got out before he started losing too much money (too much competition from the sheisters around here for an honest man to make anything).

[Tasharaps]

Hi All,
Thanks so much for all your time and help etc.... I paid £2000 for the car 2.2 executive diesel 2001 plate. The dealer has now taken the car back and says he will fix the faults for me ... I'm waiting to hear back... slightly worried as he now has the car and my cash...however his son (who is doing the repairs) actually seemed a reasonable chap. He says he can hopefully sort it out and will also do the other bits that are faulty...(handbrake, fuel filler cap etc..) I await their reply... At this stage i hope that they will rectify the situation if not i may have to take further action. Despite being a female i am not going to be put off by his narky attitude on the phone, he keeps saying hes a trained lawyer!! I'm sure this is to worry me but after joing the forum and hearing all your comments i think its a ploy!! The chap has ads in Autotrader so i thought he was genuine. As for the RAC man... i like my 406 and hope to get it right ! Even if it comes back broken i think i may stick with it as i cant think of a better car to replace it with!!..I will keep you all updated...
Natasha

[lozz]

Hi,
Well done for taking the car back, good on you,
if he was a trained lawyer he wouidnt be in the Motor trade, theres alot lot more money in the law game,
Dont take any Bull s%it from him, keep returning the car until hes got it right,

@ 2k it shouid be spot on,

[Welly]

Despite being a female i am not going to be put off by his narky attitude on the phone, he keeps saying hes a trained lawyer!!

Absolutely, do not take any crap from them, if they operate as a car trader then they have a legal duty to provide a car 'fit for purpose'.

As for being a trained Lawyer now I'm fairly, no definitely, certain that a Legal professional's take-home pay is considerably more that a used car dealer - I may be wrong maybe he's read a couple of those household legal advice books and thinks that's all you need to know

I think he took this car in as it was, with the fault, and at a drop-down price (probably gave £750.00 or something as a trade in) so at a sale price of £2,000.00 he's got plenty to play with. Don't be put off because £2K isn't too far off the mark for an Estate, perhaps a tad high but hey.

Ask them for evidence of what the faults were (from the diagnostic check) and what they have replaced on the car to fix them. 'Clearing the codes' is a temporary fix only. Keep a diary of what's been said, dates, as much as you can in case they do get shirty with you about it.

Remember - they have sold you a car that is going into 'limp mode' that is wrong, there's no two ways about it. Limp mode is an emergency function to get you to the nearest garage for repair.

[lozz]

if he was a trained lawyer he wouid know what wouid happen if the S%it hit the fan,
he wouid have to pay the money back for the car plus court costs,

seems to be alot of people down south just recently taking car dealers to court,
some end up getting the balifs to go collect,

you will have all seen it on tv no doubt

http://www.radiotimes.com/episode/pwswb ... -episode-1

[Welly]

seems to be alot of people down south just recently taking car dealers to court,
some end up getting the balifs to go collect

I think it's a reaction to our economy at the moment, lots of (previously wealthy) and slightly naive buyers finding themselves handing-back the BMW and wandering around the used car lots for something cheap...........not realising what a bloody hornets nest it is buying an old car and getting their fingers burnt.........then comes the legal bit.

10 years ago you'd take it on the chin but these days they jump straight on the phone