Ye Olde HPi Misfire

[DaiRees]

I gave it a good clean today with carb cleaner (I was amazed at how dirty my white rag was by the time I'd finished ), but it hasn't cured it

after cleaning, it needs to be synchronised, turn the ignition on and listen to the ETM it will buzz for about 30 seconds and then click, turn the ignition off and then start

Something I did notice was that when I turned the ignition on to synchronise the ETM it buzzed (more of a squeel actually) but didn't stop. I timed it for about 2 mins, still squeeling, no click!

Were the fuel pressures OK James?

Something else I was wondering about was that I remember the first time I changed the plugs there was a white pastey subtance on the top of the plugs and up inside the ends of the coil pack extensions. Obviously none in there now so does it need some?. Is that some kind of conductive stuff similar to the thermal compound you use between computer chips and heatsinks?

Any more ideas?

Dai "clutching at straws" Rees

[jameslxdt]

was it a siemens, bosch, or magnetti marreli unit?

this has got me stumped now, only other possible thing is a the coilpack, but its too expensive to just go and replace

[DaiRees]

was it a siemens, bosch, or magnetti marreli unit?

No distinguishing marks...

[Black Pearl]

Looks like im suffering with the same misfire mystery as dairees now

up to yet ive took the sparkplugs out with the bloody rare as rocking hoss $hit tool ( bought off ebay, made by a company called franklin tools, if anyone is after one ) the plug gap is bloody massive, i havent changed the gapping at all as the plugs gap are all the same. what i did notice was the engine seems to be running very rich, as the plugs are near enough black, not the normal caramel colour as a nice balanced burn should be. So i cleaned em all an put em back. still misfiring. next was clean out the throttle body, just like dairees's explanation it was covered in blow back black cack. again cleaned refitted, still misfiring. My next move is to source a coilpack ( as we all know they aint cheap ). oh yeah ive replaced the EGR valve as well as the actuator arm sheered on my old one, that didnt cure it either. so as testing goes were both level pegging. next week im going to ring the local stealer for a diagnosis now i know everything i can do myself has been done. Ill update as soon as i can when they give me a verdict....if any.

[DaiRees]

Looks like im suffering with the same misfire mystery as dairees now

Oh man, sorry to hear that Pearl! I've just been surfing and found mention of a "camshaft dephaser fault". £600 , and one guy said the misfire came back after a few weeks

[DaiRees]

Forgot to mention earlier that I've had the plugs out of mine today too. The gap is supposed to be pretty big (can't remember exactly how much but it's the biggest gap I've ever seen). The colour was pretty good on mine, one seemed a bit darker than the other 3 but generally they were a nice light colour. I cleaned them all, didn't bother regapping, put wd40 in the ends of the extensions to ensure that they slipped onto the plugs nicely and clened the contacts in the multiplug for the coil pack. I haven't been out today so we'll see if there's any improvement tomorrow, but I'm not hopefull .

[Black Pearl]

oh cack,

hopefully the new sparkplugs will cure the fault, be picking em up midweek, though before i got the plugs out it was miss firing a little bit, since i got em out, cleaned em and put em back it seems to have got worse. Ideally it would of cured the fault but at least messing with em has shown me that they must have something to do with it, why else would it of got worse with me cleaning em, no gap setting or anything ive even put conductive grease on the " HT " springy link jobbys. Hopefully its the plugs at fault with mine. or id even go as far to say as the coil pack. I bloody hope its got nowt to do with the cam ill let ya know how it goes when ive got the new ones in. ill ask the stealer what the gap should be as its bloody massive, must have some bottle that coilpack to produce a spark to fill that gap... does make me wonder

[DaiRees]

Well I am leaning on a wooden desk......

Mine's alot better today, hardly any misfire, I reckon it might have been the fiddling with the HT coilpack extension thingies that I did before I put the coilpack back on. I actually pulled them off the coilpack a bit (effectively lengthening them slightly) then WD40'd the insides of the extensions to ensure that the rubber didn't "stick" to the ceramic of the plug and hold it off. I really don't like that setup, seems that the connection is reliant on the springy bit touching the top of the plug . I much preferred shoving the HT lead on until it clicked over the plug top.

Something for you to try Pearl

Conductive grease eh? That was one of the questions I asked up there . Where do I get it?

[Black Pearl]

Cheers for the tip dairees,

aint long applied it to my HT links, got me new sparkplugs today, while i was at the dealer i asked about the gapping, he said about 1mm, i know bloody massive, my old plugs were a little bigger than that, though the new ones have been gapped and set into place, ive stretched the springs to apply some more pressure, its a crap way of doing things, i agree id rather " click " the leads into place, ive wd40'd them, and coated em from top to bottom with conductive grease, im pretty sure you can get it from maplin, though its not as a bigger tube as the one i have, to be truthful i " borrowed " it from severn trent when i was working in a power station with my dad, thought it would come in useful for my mini's dizzy cap, it sure did !

ill let you know of the results, if its still there i can only point the finger to the coilpack. though that may have to wait as we all know they aint cheap.

[Black Pearl]

The result of changing the sparkplugs turned out to be a success !!! no more misfiring, idling is a lot better as well as everything else granted 45 quid for sparkplugs aint cheap. though it does beat 150 quid for a coilpack. I hope this helps with your misfiring problems Dairees it sure did mine

just a useful link should anyone requre the sodding " special tool " to get your sparkplugs out :

http://www.franklin-tools.co.uk/acatalo ... INE_3.html
( the socket is a 3/4" driven sort )

item code for the sparkplug socket :

TA264 M8 14mm Magnetic Spark Plug Socket

Should anyone get one of these sockets ya might want to drill the magnetic ring out of the socket itself cus i thought i bought the wrong one when i tried to use it, turns out it was this magnet not giving me enough clearence, just thought id let ya know in case anyone decides to get one
oh yeah with some trial and error gapping, looong into the evening ive found that running the plugs on a 1mm gap seems to work best, considering the stealer told me to run em at 2.5mm i thought to myself " you know nothing " so i decided to find out meself armed with my trusty mike and feelers lol

hope this helps ya out dairees, it sure did cure my misfiring fault, as the symptoms are near as dammit the same as yours id give it a go before loosing all hope and selling a relative to get a coilpack.

Good Luck mate.

[Welly]

The words chickens, hatch and counting spring to mind but I sincerely hope I'm wrong, really I do, but you know Peugeots.....

[Black Pearl]

I know its a bit optimistic to say such a simple fault has been a mystery for such a long time when after all that time it was just the plugs at fault lol but what else could it be ? i know theres a lot of components to make the ignition system and fuel supply, But after all this fancy gedgetry it comes down to the basic 4 stroke cycle, suck squeeze bang blow, if ya aint banging properly then ya aint firing properly, 1st thing to check is the sparkplugs, and by chance its cured the fault, anything else in that bracket of ignition would cause erratic idle and more symptoms, if its a simple misfire i cant see what else it could be. Even replacing the EGR valve done nothing to performance or emission as it went through an MOT with it knackerd, makes me wonder with these big fancy engines they bolt so much controlling crap on em that does it actually need it in the first place ? i really dont think so, if the dealers really dont want us to mess with our cars they should of just made a simple engine with tools only they can get there hands on, not put all this fancy electronic crap everywhere and make it sound like a bloody dyson under the bonnet, in some cases make it look like one as well. -- ill stop ranting now -- lol.

[Welly]

You're bang on there fella.

I reckon in 2 years time the scrap yards will be littered with 10 year old HDi's where they have become uneconomical to repair through costly electrical gremlins whereas the mechanical guts of the engine will still be barely run in

[steve_earwig]

True, it'll be heartbreaking every time you go to the scrappies.

They need all the electronic gubbins because of required performance, economy and emissions, without it they'd be the gas-guzzling slugs of old, diesels more so that petrols because of all the garbage they like to chuck out the exhaust. I suppose eventually they'll be so clean you could stick a baby by the exaust and need a fap the same size as the fuel tank.

One think that puzzles me is this fap regeneration, ok almost zero emissions most of the time but what about all the clouds it chuffs out when it's regenerating? Is that euro 4 compliant?

[DaiRees]

Cheers Pearl, I changed the plugs ages ago when the problem first apeared, but it's much worse now than it was then so it's worth trying another set I suppose. I'll order a set up and let you know the outcome. Please let me know if your problem stays gone!

Oh by the way, the improvement from the clean up I did last weekend was temporary, got progressively worse throughout the week and by Friday it was fully annoying again.