D8 Cruise Control Retrofit

Talk about the 406's electrical system, what wires do what, how to add extra functionality, etc.

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jonsowman
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D8 Cruise Control Retrofit

Post by jonsowman »

I know you're all probably saying "oh god, not this again". But there doesn't seem to have been a huge amount of investigation into this for the D8. One post on here basically says "yes, if you're got the wiring in place".

So, questions are:

1) What should I be looking for on the car? I understand I'd need the ECU, solenoid, vac actuator and the control stalk. Are the brake and clutch switches fitted to all cars? I understand if the wiring loom is not in place this would be a Herculean retrofit and not at all worth it.
2) Which D8s were fitted with it? Servicebox shows cruise on the 2.1TD, but was it actually fitted to any? I know it was fitted to the 3.0 V6, perhaps other petrol models? Looking for scrappers to steal the bits from!

Thanks for any help :)
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Doggy
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Re: D8 Cruise Control Retrofit

Post by Doggy »

I don't honestly know if cruise was availble for your car, but suspect not. As you noted it was offered for D8 v6's, (& possibly other petrol verisons), but this system used a vacuum actuator to physically move the throttle, as is common on petrol engined cars.

Some D9 HDi's were available with cruise from about late 2000, this system is completely different, beng handled internally by the engine ecu, without any hardware to work the accelerator. As you don't have the same ecu, this isn't an option.

Whether the 'petrol' version could be adapated is unclear, or there are aftermarket offerings........
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waue1978
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Re: D8 Cruise Control Retrofit

Post by waue1978 »

Doggy wrote:I don't honestly know if cruise was availble for your car, but suspect not. As you noted it was offered for D8 v6's, (& possibly other petrol verisons), but this system used a vacuum actuator to physically move the throttle, as is common on petrol engined cars.

Some D9 HDi's were available with cruise from about late 2000, this system is completely different, beng handled internally by the engine ecu, without any hardware to work the accelerator. As you don't have the same ecu, this isn't an option.

Whether the 'petrol' version could be adapated is unclear, or there are aftermarket offerings........
Pretty sure I've seen a couple of exec TDs with cruise, but haven't seen many.

The D9 cruise isn't as clear cut as that. Mine was a late 2000 & never had the wiring in place, but pre 2000 D9s seem to be pre-wired for everything (apart from electric rear windows). The 99 LX I found in a local scrappy was pre-wired for electric seats, heated suits & cruise, but it was almost as if they did away with the extra wiring in 2000 (about the same time LX got electric rear windows & the Rapier got the black interior). After that I've been told that all of the fully multiplex (COMM2000) models can be fitted with it on a plug & play basis. Not too sure now though after Bailes had limited success fitting it to his Rapier.
2000/X Peugeot 406 110 HDi LX Family 93k to 2000/W BMW 530D SE Auto 84k to 2003/03 Peugeot Partner Hdi Escapade 98k to 2003/53 Vauxhall Zafira DTi Elegance 74k

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jonsowman
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Re: D8 Cruise Control Retrofit

Post by jonsowman »

Thanks guys, very helpful of you. It's good to know that there were at least some TDs fitted with cruise. The 2.1TD has a throttle cable that goes from the pedal to a pot in the engine bay, so I assume the vac actuator somehow connects to that. Here are some images from SB to make things clearly (arguably)

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Image
Image

I assume the unmarked thing on the left in the final image is the vac actuator, I can't find a part number for this anywhere. Any ideas what part 1 is in this picture (Reg Vacuum Pump)? It doesn't look like the braking system vacuum pump on the side of the cylinder head.

If anyone has any pictures like image 1 but of a real car, that'd be helpful since I can see where things are meant to go.

Any engine bay shots of a cruise D8 would be good as well, so I can see how the vac actuator is wired up.

Am I right in thinking part 5 (electro valve) in the 3rd image is the solenoid for the cruise system? Haynes mentions one but is in general very brief in this area and therefore not much help!

Also, found this:
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Peugeot-406-c ... 0960513007
It's for the coupe but it definitely looks like the kit in the SB pictures above. It doesn't seem to include the ECU though.

Thanks again guys :)
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Re: D8 Cruise Control Retrofit

Post by mjb »

jonsowman wrote:I assume the unmarked thing on the left in the final image is the vac actuator, I can't find a part number for this anywhere.
Correct.
Any ideas what part 1 is in this picture (Reg Vacuum Pump)? It doesn't look like the braking system vacuum pump on the side of the cylinder head.
Am I right in thinking part 5 (electro valve) in the 3rd image is the solenoid for the cruise system?
Correct. When the CC is activated, the pump runs at a constant rate. The solenoid varies the amount of vacuum in the system to control how much the actuator pulls on the throttle.
If anyone has any pictures like image 1 but of a real car, that'd be helpful since I can see where things are meant to go.

Any engine bay shots of a cruise D8 would be good as well, so I can see how the vac actuator is wired up.
You won't find pictures because it's an utter arse to get to and virtually impossible to see with the gearbox in place. It's mounted on the n/s of the engine bay right at the bottom behind the gearbox and beneath the brake fluid reservoir. You can see it from underneath the car, just above the n/s end of the steering rack, but iirc access to the nuts+bolts from underneath is nigh-on impossible on an assembled car.

It's located within a plastic bag which is sealed with a zip and a zip tie. You can see the bottom of the bag on my V6 at the top of this picture taken from just behind the n/s wheelarch, taken with the subframe off the car, driveshafts removed, steering rack swung away, and the engine+gearbox half out. I think the yellowish bit shown to the left of the bag is the front subframe bolting point and to the top-right of the picture is the rear subframe bolting point

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I have at some point on one of my V6s (I think the coupé) replaced the solenoid valve. IIRC I wanted to take pictures, but couldn't since the whole job was pretty much done by feel. I worked from above and I had to rip the plastic bag open because the zip at the bottom had jammed. I believe it's 2 nuts and a bolt holding the frame (2 in servicebox) to the body, with an electrical connector on the pump, and another on the solenoid, then it can be lifted out.

The actuator attached to the throttle body is not electrical - its only connection is a hose to the solenoid valve
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lozz
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Re: D8 Cruise Control Retrofit

Post by lozz »

couidnt you use the bits of a coupe ?


like these ones, http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Peugeot-406-c ... 3f16814fef
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Re: D8 Cruise Control Retrofit

Post by jonsowman »

Excellent stuff, that's hugely helpful mjb, thank you.

Lozz, indeed I am looking at using the coupe bits but the XUDs were never fitted to the coupe (I don't think?) so it's going to involve some investigation. I'm trying to find a XUD car with cruise fitted so that I can go and examine it. If anyone knows of one, please do let me know :)

I found this image on the coupe club which shows the position of the vac pump, and it does indeed look like a total pain to get to:
Image

Is there any reason the pump has to be mounted in that position? I assume there's just a cable going to it somewhere, plus a vac hose.

Additionally, this is a picture of the vac actuator connected to the throttle body on the V6. As you can see the throttle body has a ball joint for the actuator to attach to, whereas I can't see where one would exist on the XUD.
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Here's a pic of my engine bay, with the throttle cable assembly at the top right:
Image

I'm going to go and have a look at the wiring loom on my car in a bit, will let you know what I find!
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RayneR
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Re: D8 Cruise Control Retrofit

Post by RayneR »

Well, i'll try to help with some of my experience retrofitting into a early (may) 2000 110hdi Estate.

1 - My car originally came only with sunroof,CD changer in boot,4 eletric windows,eletric heated exterior mirrors,fog lights,rain sensor,no side airbags,no armrest.

2 - No trip computer, no cruise control.

3 - After found this excellent forum i could investigate a bit more...and bam!, i retro fitted trip computer by changing stalk and enabling on BSI.

4 - After looking under the seat i found some wires that were only connected into a blank socket ( meaning i have the wires to place eletric and heated seats + side airbags ).

5 - And after looking to the cover next to the diagnosis socket and under the steering wheel i found that i had the wires to place the cruise ON/OFF button and cruise stalk, purchased it, but it didnt work. After a year +/- later ( recently ) i was able to put cruise working, i needed to swap my ecu to a version that had cruise on it's software/firmware, and then enable it with PP2000. It worked right away, obviously i needed to go into a autoeletrician so they could recode the new ecu for my car. It was cheap, i was lucky the guy who was around my car was the boss there and in total i payed 70 EUR for recode and activation of cruise.

6 - Now its working.

7 - My friends August 2000 110hdi Estate came with everything like mine except, he's came with trip computer, no sunroof, radio with CD,side airbags,armrests. And he's don't have any extra wires under the hood ...So he will never be able to retrofit cruise or eletric heated seats...unless he does some wiring wich i found dificult since i have never saw anything related to the pre-multiplex cruise stalk wiring ...

8 - After going into an eletrician about my dodgy diagnosis socket, he said that the reason that mine was with extra wires and my friend's not is that he's was manufactured in another peugeot factory

Well this doesn't have anything to do with D8 but at least can give an idea...
2000/May 406 Estate 2.0 HDI 110bhp DW10ATED now with 205k km & now with cruise control & now remaped @ 134bhp :lol:
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Re: D8 Cruise Control Retrofit

Post by jonsowman »

Thank you RayneR, even though it's not a D8 the experience is very useful!

So, I'm back from my foray into the world of Peugeot wiring, here's what I found:

The panel where the cruise activation button is blank, there's no space for the button:
Image

However, on removing it, there are two connectors behind it, I think the orange one is the cruise one. This bodes well.
Image

Now the cruise ECU. I think this is the plug, it looks the same as the ones on the Coupe forum in the cruise retrofit How To
Image
Image

I can't see the wiring for the vacuum pump, but I think I'll need to jack up the car, remove the passenger side wheel and the arch liners before I can get to that.

The final thing is the throttle assembly. There's no obvious point for the actuator to attach to, but I can believe the ball joint screws into one of the holes in the rotating centre section. This is where it would be really useful to examine a car with cruise fitted to see how it all goes together.
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Re: D8 Cruise Control Retrofit

Post by RayneR »

The D8 would be something that i wouldn't bother, that involves too much work and money, and in the end you can end up with a non working cruise and still wasted money ...

But apparently you have almost everything you need, even the ecu plug :o
2000/May 406 Estate 2.0 HDI 110bhp DW10ATED now with 205k km & now with cruise control & now remaped @ 134bhp :lol:
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Doggy
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Re: D8 Cruise Control Retrofit

Post by Doggy »

I did read an ad for a 2.1TD estate, which claimed to have cruise at the weekend, (on autotrader), but I'm fairly sure it didn't have a cc stalk, so I assumed it was bill hooks.
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Re: D8 Cruise Control Retrofit

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Re: D8 Cruise Control Retrofit

Post by jonsowman »

RayneR: I totally agree, it is a risk. However if I can find all the necessary parts of the wiring loom, I'm willing to take the risk. I understand what you mean though :)

Doggy: There seem to be precious few about, lozz appears to have found one though! (Thanks lozz) I will get in touch and ask very, very nicely if he/she wouldn't mind taking some pictures of the engine bay for me.
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Re: D8 Cruise Control Retrofit

Post by lozz »

This company http://www.1stchoice.co.uk/cars/peugeot ... -lx-family
is listing cruise control parts for the 2.1. might be worth a look, not to buy but just for the part numbers perhaps,
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Re: D8 Cruise Control Retrofit

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