Senior Citizens 'reasoning' (for new car)

[Welly]

Talking to the FIL last night and he's put a deposit on a 2 year old shitroen C4 1.6D which sounds like is going to cost about £8K (was a bit shifty on the cost) to replace his 54 plate shitroen Pickarsehole with a 2.0 Pezz engine. The existing motor has been faultless for the last 4 years and does about 34MPG.

He said he's buying a new car because it will only cost £30.00 per year to Tax and will do OMGMPG's being diesel and that. I've heard this kinda sh*t before, people buying new cars because "they're cheap to run" but don't they factor in the depreciation? that there C4 is gonna drop like a stone, probably £1,500.00 per year and I daren't tell him about the perils of running a Common Rail strangled Diesel to the shops and back.

It got me thinking, why change a car anyway? within reason as long as the bodyshell isn't rusting away there's no reason why you couldn't run a car for 20 years or more if you looked after it well. Is it just that we want new cars or we want to be seen in new cars even? the key thing here is maintenance obviously and it's only nutters like us on here that would loose sleep over gearbox oil and such but do you get what I mean? you MUST be able to run a car for 20 years, spend decent money on it, and still be cheaper than keep changing cars every few years?

[lozz]

It got me thinking, why change a car anyway?


good point,
Most probs got bored with car,

alot of people get bored quick with cars, ido anyway, unless its pre-90s

[gumby6371]

First of all the real world MPG's on a 1.6 HDI are nowhere near what they quote then tag onto that the enevitable blocked DPF strangling the engine and you down to 32-34 MPG.
The 1.6 tends to be a bench flash ECU so factor in circa £500 to remap if you can find a place to do it when .gov makes it illegal.
Bizarrely the 1.6 is an ideal engine for pootling around town, very smooth and quiet with a small turbo so boost comes in early and smoothly with very little lag but the DPF hates that kind of driving, good combination it is not!

So thats running costs dealt with then as you say depreciation will hammer you, MIL (also a pensioner) bought a brand spanking 1.9TD Jetta and traded it in 2 years later and lost £8K!!!
Yes trade in is always lower than private sale but she lost nearly 50% of what she paid after 2 years which is unbelievable.

Then factor in all the over the top service costs the dealers insist on doing at highway robbery prices to maintain the warranty and you're soon digging very deep to run your new 'economical' motor.

MIL now has a 1.9TD Golf, uber cheap insurance, low tax and does around 2,500 miles a year, even on very conservative estimates my old XUD was cheaper to keep on the road. Also much nicer to drive as your ass didn't go to sleep after 5 minutes unlike every VAG car I've been in, do they actually make the seats out of wood??
I had my 1.9 for 2 years, £350 insurance, £240 tax and sold her for £100 less than I paid for her, only outlay - home servicing £100, 4 new tyres £200, a new egg-sauce from fleabay for £50 and about £120 for discs pads and shoes.
My maths makes that £1750 over 2 years plus fuel

[Welly]

Lozz, you're probably right about getting bored, then they justify changing it with some ridiculous reason and feel ok about it, in other words - "I've never liked this car and need an excuse for changing it".

gumby - you make an excellent example, the depreciation is blindly overlooked by most motorists.

[Doggy]

It got me thinking, why change a car anyway? within reason as long as the bodyshell isn't rusting away there's no reason why you couldn't run a car for 20 years or more if you looked after it well. Is it just that we want new cars or we want to be seen in new cars even? the key thing here is maintenance obviously and it's only nutters like us on here that would loose sleep over gearbox oil and such but do you get what I mean? you MUST be able to run a car for 20 years, spend decent money on it, and still be cheaper than keep changing cars every few years?

I suspect I'm going to find out. Mostly because I can't think of anything newer than the 406 that fits my, (admittedly very narrow), definition of acceptable* and isn't a potential money pit.

Cars definitely last longer these days, witness the number of 20+ year old examples still going around, (passed a superficially tidy looking 'K' reg. chavalier last night). Realistically it becomes more difficult to get spares, the dealer only bits won't be available much, if anything, beyond 10 years. The market in stuff to keep old cars going will also adapt to longer lifetimes, (& probably already has to some extent). Don't know what the current average lifespan of cars is, but I wouldn't be surprised to see some 406's making it to 20 years+ - some are on 18/19 now.


* roomy, comfy, wiv cruze, armrests for the vertically challenged, cheap, oodles of grunt and w/out poxy shallow back windows or butt-ugly front end.......

So far, I have a short list of zero .

[lozz]

its false economy to sell a car unless its fubard,
you never gets back what youve paid for the new tyres /brakes new parts, servicing etc, or what ever,

[Welly]

If I take my Volvo, it's 9 years old now and I've had it 5 years and know the thing inside out. I've never owned a car for so long but I do like it, it has a large petrol engine which would see most people running for the hills but to me it makes sense; it can pootle about being lazy and fairly economical or it can be raced like a hooligan but most of all it's tough and simple and I'm not sure what I could replace it with that would be 'better' for me.

The most complex thing in my car is, I think, the equivalent of the BSi unit these can give trouble but there'll always be someone out there who can fix them if it becomes common (a bit like my Boiler PCB the other week, a tiny common fault which can be fixed for £30.00).

Rust is our main enemy for sure.

There's a 24 year old Merc 190e petrol around the corner from me and it's bloody fantastic, I kinda admire the guy for driving it (he commutes to work every day with it).

To be fair, I think I've done so much to my car to keep it 'right' then even if I did buy something new or had to have a company car I'd keep the Volvo in the garage, no-one else deserves to have it

[Bailes1992]

Back in 2003 my Grandperants bought a W reg 306 Meridian with a 1.8 XU petrol lump it had 35,000miles with full dealer service history.
It was impeccably reliable until 2009 when the rear back box started blowing. I replaced it for then for £40 in parts and cleaned and protected the red of the exhaust while I was at it.

Then in 2012 the clutch started slipping. It went in for its annual service and the mechanic quoted them £170 to replace the clutch and £200 to replace the overdue timing belt.

At this stage according to them it was becoming totally unreliable, a money pit, it was uneconomic to repair and it needed to go!

They replaced it with a little Chevrolet Spark and consider it an 'upgrade'.

I tried to persuade them otherwise but they were having none of it!

I was pissed off most of all because the 306 was absolutely immaculate! It had 60k on the clock at 12 years old with full service history and There wasn't one mark on it. They were given £250 part ex for it because of the clutch! And they wouldn't let me buy it off them because it wasn't fair on me to have to spend all that money on it!

[Welly]

Back in 2003 my Grandperants bought a W reg 306 Meridian with a 1.8 XU petrol lump it had 35,000miles with full dealer service history.
It was impeccably reliable until 2009 when the rear back box started blowing. I replaced it for then for £40 in parts and cleaned and protected the red of the exhaust while I was at it.

Then in 2012 the clutch started slipping. It went in for its annual service and the mechanic quoted them £170 to replace the clutch and £200 to replace the overdue timing belt.

At this stage according to them it was becoming totally unreliable, a money pit, it was uneconomic to repair and it needed to go!

They replaced it with a little Chevrolet Spark and consider it an 'upgrade'.

I tried to persuade them otherwise but they were having none of it!

I was pissed off most of all because the 306 was absolutely immaculate! It had 60k on the clock at 12 years old with full service history and There wasn't one mark on it. They were given £250 part ex for it because of the clutch! And they wouldn't let me buy it off them because it wasn't fair on me to have to spend all that money on it!

f*ck sake, see what I mean? thinking about it my Dad came out with a corker one year when he announced he was buying (yet another) new Focus - "it's due its first MOT, so I thought I'd get a brand-new car" bearing in mind the poor 3-year old Focus facing this grueling MOT had almost 12,000 miles on it funnily enough this time round he seems like he's going to keep the 61 plate Focus for a good while (maybe he learnt his lesson in depreciation).

[steve_earwig]

My dad gave in and bought his first new car ever, a Zafira, in 2004 (I think it was), only to find it wasn't exactly the same car as he test drove, different tyres, different suspension, and it didn't get on with his back so he gave it to my brother. He's now on his 3rd C5 SW since then, all second-hand. My brother still has the Zaf, the Bora he bought brand new about the same time, mainly for my sis-in-law to drive, started developing so many faults he traded it in for a year-old Passat last year. I gather it's just been back again for more warranty work

[GingerMagic]

My Mum-in-Law wanted me to buy / find / get her a new car to replace her Clio diesel when the cambelt snapped. She was looking at getting a loan for a car, about £6000 because she would pay less road tax per year....

She is nearly 70, so spending £6000 to save about £300 over 3 years in road tax seemed a bit short sighted. I bought her a Skoda Fabia 1.9Tdi ( PD ) 54plate, fsh and low mileage for £1300 - its been brilliant so far ( and very quick.. ) only £120 tax per year compared to £225 for the old Clio, and she loves it.

Old people.....pfffft.

[trufflehunt]

I reckon they only do it so that their offspring can't get hold of too much of their money.

Must say though..... I do think 306's are very worthy, unobjectionable cars... but when God
was trying to define 'boring'..., I'm certain he had the 306 in mind.

[lozz]

306's arnt boring,

ive had alot of fun with them, dashboard aint much too look at but rest of car is a good desighn,

[GingerMagic]

I've had a 306 for 13 years and it never broke down or failed to start - its a good looking car too.
Now it sits in the drive not being used as the new Picasso is more spacious and practical - I just can't part with the 306.

It is dull inside though....

[FarmerPug]

I dont really mind the 306's dash its quite nice the way it curves along the top giving a distinctive side for the driver and passenger. Its a bit out of date by modern standards, there wasn't many toys like climate control or a trip computer but it did the job, and was much better than the 307s dash.