2.1td lucas to bosch pump swap?

[craighuckins]

Hi folks!
I've just bought a great condition 1997 406 2.1td with a locked ecu and the dreaded lucas EPIC pump fitted. I've sourced a bosch pump (with sprocket, bracket, metal lines and injectors!) from a '95 2.1td xantia, just wondering if it'll go in OK? Anyone done this? Bit worried about shelling out the £140 for the pump if it's not going to fit, there seems to be more than one mechanical cable going to this pump, are the cables other than throttle likely just to be advancers for cold start etc? will it just be a case of hardwiring stop solenoid to switched live and away we go or is this going to be a nightmare job?
HELP!
regards, craig.

[DaiRees]

Hiya Craig, welcome to the club.

Looks like you might have to be the trailblazer on this one fella....

[craighuckins]

hmmm, looks like you could be right! I've got a pump and injectors ordered so will give it a go. Can't see why it wouldn't work though, it seems that plenty of xantia and XM owners have done this conversion, as well as ford transit owners. Will be so glad to see the back of lucas Ep(idem)ic! Only problem I may have is rev counter not working as this is controlled electronicaly by the ECU. Might have to leave it in place just for that! Heh! Heh! Veg oil here we come!!!!

Anybody in the Whitby or Middlesbrough area any good with setting up pump timing?????

[Doggy]

Hello craig & welcome

My bro was interested in this idea too - likes the idea of a 2.1, but won't touch anything else with a lucas pump after variuos woes with his 306 - neither of us has managed to find any info on the swap

Please keep us posted

[mark21TD]

I have read that it can be done and there is a thread on www.vegetableoildiesel.co.uk about this at the mo.
if it works out for this guy then I'm doing mine

[miniman7]

me too!!!!

Perhaps a write up would be great once it works?

[mon]

Yea i am in the middle of trying get mine done, I've sourced a mechanical bosch off a 405 1993 , need to get it to the car to see if it will fit been advised that it will from a guy over on my thread at
http://www.vegetableoildiesel.co.uk/for ... ?tid=12561

the pump i have is off a 1993 405 purely mechanical no ecu inputs that i can see.




would be good to hear how you get on, likewise i'll let you know how i do.

[mon]

Criag the connections you will have will be

-A throttle obviously cable and mechanical on the bosch as oppose to the "fly by wire on the lucas"
-2 wires for the stop solenoid one to ground one to the ignition.
-1 wire for the cold advance
-1 cable for the antistall mechanically connected to a thermostat.

How are you getting on?

I've got my car in pieces have sourced a 405 pump bracket and pipes. have installed the bracket and will put in the new pump tommorrow.

just need to get the pulley off the crank some nutter put 1/2 a litre of locktight on it took 1 metre bar and allot of jumping on it to get the nut off.

any tips on removing locktight?

[jasper5]

To remove the locktight, soak it in WD40, it will melt. After you have soaked it for a while, hit the front of the pulley where the keyway is, that will crack the locktight and free it off.

I've also used acetone in the past (nail polish remover). No, it wasn't mine

[craighuckins]

Fuel pump arrived today.
What I'm wondering is how I'm going to connect up the fast idle controller, guess I'm going to have to use a housing from the thermostat from an xud9.
Also, what's this business with the square turret on top of the pump? where does the hose connect to?
Is this something to do with engine vacuum?
help!

[mark21TD]

Hi mon.
Glad to someone else from the veg forum on here, I see you receved the gauge and addaptor today.
mark

[mon]

craing the hose that connects to the top is the vaccum pipe which goes to the inlet manifold was connected to a sensor for the Epic electronic system. this will increase the fuel injected when the turbo is being used, if this isn't connected no turbo

Yea Mark only just joined great forum, yea got the bits today although haveing trouble getting the new cam belt on...

Have all locked in place (IP CAM Flywheel) and lined up with the tensioner fully set to the slackest posistion but still cant get the belt on. the old belt seems to be the same length and have double/triple checked i have got the correct replacement.

really puzzled as what to do?? have followed haynes to the letter.

Any ideas?

[Doggy]

Just ideas, I don't know the answer.....

Is the IP shaft further out from the block with the Bosch pump?
Does it need a different bracket?
Is a 1.9's belt longer?

[jasper5]

There are different lengths of belt, count the number of teeth. Mark the belt with a bit of masking tape, then count the teeth.

Does the old belt fit? If not, you may need the next size longer belt, I believe there is a two teeth difference.

If the old belt fits, you may just have to remove the locking bolts from the injection pump pulley and the camshaft pulley (mark the pulleys positions first with tipex or paint in a couple of places).This will allow a bit more movement in the belt, if this was your problem, check the locking bolts will go back in before tensioning the belt.

Of course it just may be the fact that some belts are easier to fit than others.

[mon]

yea they are different shafts, you need to have the bosch one with the bosch pump obviously
However the lengths of the shaft are different they still line up with the cams, the actual outer diameter of the sprockets are identical with the same number of teeth.

Just make sure if you are swapping your take the bosch bracket or if not you move te bolts in the bracket to the bosch holes.

Managed to get the belt on with a bit of prodding, not easy though, would of been easier with a screw driver , although didn't want to damage the belt so didn't.